tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3756272660800605663.post5457380631218406987..comments2023-06-12T06:58:06.277-07:00Comments on Nj's arya blog: Indo-European ConnectionsNirjhar007http://www.blogger.com/profile/12880827026479135118noreply@blogger.comBlogger2273125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3756272660800605663.post-82662145268165886302018-04-05T03:05:32.164-07:002018-04-05T03:05:32.164-07:00According though to others Gr. κλαμαρός klamaros (...<i>According though to others Gr. κλαμαρός klamaros (meaning in Hesychius also "sick") is supposed to be a variation of κλαδαρός kladaros </i><br /><br />I see :).<br /><br /><i>And I'm a little confused; Sum. saĝ "head" and šag "heart" look close, too. </i><br /><br />Yeah :D.Nirjhar007https://www.blogger.com/profile/12880827026479135118noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3756272660800605663.post-6503949161324697532018-04-02T02:22:19.965-07:002018-04-02T02:22:19.965-07:00Pokorny has this root / lemma: klem-, klēm-, klem-...Pokorny has this root / lemma: klem-, klēm-, klem-<br />English meaning: weak, ailing, feeble<br />German meaning: `schlaff, matt, siech'<br />Note: (barely better as klēm- : klǝm- must be assumed)<br />Material: Das Old Indian bietet on the one hand klā́myati, klā́mati `wird tired, erschlafft', on the other hand śrā́myati `wird tired, möht sich ab, kasteit sich', śrāntá- `ermödet, abgearbeitet', śráma- m. `Ermödung, tiredness, Erschöpfung'; śramaṇá- `sich kasteiend, Bettelmönch' is about die ostasiat. Sprachen as Schamane `magician' after Europa gekommen (idg. Reihenwechselö; also die Doppeldeutigkeit the Liquida erschwert das judgement; from kerm- `exhaust' jedenfalls wenigstens through die Vokalstellunggeschieden);<br />gr. κλαμαράν πλαδαράν, ἀσθενῆ Hes.;<br />air. clam `Aussötziger', cymr. acorn. claf, mbret. claff, nbret. klañv, klañ `sick'.<br />References: WP. I 498.<br />Page(s): 602-603<br />According though to others Gr. κλαμαρός klamaros (meaning in Hesychius also "sick") is supposed to be a variation of κλαδαρός kladaros <br />http://www.perseus.tufts.edu/hopper/text?doc=Perseus%3Atext%3A1999.04.0057%3Aentry%3Dklamaro%2Fs<br />which means also something "shaking", suggesting a parssage to KRD (KLD > KRD) like "heart" etc.<br />http://www.perseus.tufts.edu/hopper/text?doc=Perseus%3Atext%3A1999.04.0057%3Aentry%3Dkladaro%2Fs<br />And I'm a little confused; Sum. saĝ "head" and šag "heart" look close, too. Probably unrelated, though.<br /><br />Kyriakos Samelishttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09514429998909094452noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3756272660800605663.post-39239317126666781982018-04-02T01:39:38.602-07:002018-04-02T01:39:38.602-07:00Thanks , I agree! .Thanks , I agree! .Nirjhar007https://www.blogger.com/profile/12880827026479135118noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3756272660800605663.post-54294496664269235152018-04-02T01:27:10.633-07:002018-04-02T01:27:10.633-07:00It's also that the head is round... But I thin...It's also that the head is round... But I think we have said already about that, haven't we? (I don't remember all of what have been said all these years :D)<br />As I have seen somewhere, there is also Skrt. klama for "fatigue, exhausted":<br />http://spokensanskrit.org/index.php?tran_input=klama&direct=se&script=hk&link=yes&mode=3<br />which, according to the author, is a KLM version of the SRM.<br />Meaning, it must be a KL/KR/SR situation. Kyriakos Samelishttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09514429998909094452noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3756272660800605663.post-64636154575158070062018-04-02T01:05:17.629-07:002018-04-02T01:05:17.629-07:00This is a very good notion Kyriakos!:).This is a very good notion Kyriakos!:).Nirjhar007https://www.blogger.com/profile/12880827026479135118noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3756272660800605663.post-23104347901918779772018-04-02T00:31:46.522-07:002018-04-02T00:31:46.522-07:00An interesting thing is that, according to Pokorny...An interesting thing is that, according to Pokorny and others, Gr. κάρος karos "heavy sleep, deep sleep" is connected to the root of "head" (k'er). Maybe this was also connected to a meaning of "uplift, elevated".<br />Kyriakos Samelishttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09514429998909094452noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3756272660800605663.post-72883335840994959082018-03-30T05:54:37.206-07:002018-03-30T05:54:37.206-07:00Many roots we have seen use to have their origin a...<i>Many roots we have seen use to have their origin at some kind of "circular motion" :D; this is also for "uplifting", "hanging" and other related things...</i><br /><br />Yeah :D .<br /><br /><i> *krem is an extension of som *ker and Skrt. s'ram for "fatigue" etc is realeted to that root, then there is perhaps a possibility of a comparison with Greek κάρος karos "heavy sleep, deep sleep" (from some **kar obviously)</i><br /><br />I agree! :).Nirjhar007https://www.blogger.com/profile/12880827026479135118noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3756272660800605663.post-75617701413134888302018-03-30T03:40:16.224-07:002018-03-30T03:40:16.224-07:00Many roots we have seen use to have their origin a...Many roots we have seen use to have their origin at some kind of "circular motion" :D; this is also for "uplifting", "hanging" and other related things...<br />BTW, I have now an idea, that if *krem is an extension of som *ker and Skrt. s'ram for "fatigue" etc is realeted to that root, then there is perhaps a possibility of a comparison with Greek κάρος karos "heavy sleep, deep sleep" (from some **kar obviously):<br />http://www.perseus.tufts.edu/hopper/text?doc=Perseus%3Atext%3A1999.04.0057%3Aentry%3Dka%2Fros1<br />https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/carusKyriakos Samelishttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09514429998909094452noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3756272660800605663.post-45459551548342556612018-03-30T03:32:40.305-07:002018-03-30T03:32:40.305-07:00I think so :).I think so :).Nirjhar007https://www.blogger.com/profile/12880827026479135118noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3756272660800605663.post-29299607375683180982018-03-30T03:27:50.509-07:002018-03-30T03:27:50.509-07:00Bomhard's root was this one, I think:
425. Pro...Bomhard's root was this one, I think:<br />425. Proto-Nostratic (n.) *kºar-a ‘edge, side, bank’<br />Perhaps a derivative of:<br />(vb.) *kºar- ‘to twist, turn, spin, or wind around’;<br />(n.) *kºar-a ‘ring, circle, curve’; (adj.) ‘round, curved, twisted’ Kyriakos Samelishttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09514429998909094452noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3756272660800605663.post-52842067645781547482018-03-30T03:15:01.853-07:002018-03-30T03:15:01.853-07:00kar [HARBOR] (251x: ED IIIa, ED IIIb, Old Akkadian...kar [HARBOR] (251x: ED IIIa, ED IIIb, Old Akkadian, Lagash II, Ur III, Early Old Babylonian, Old Babylonian) wr. kar "harbor, quay" Akk. kāruNirjhar007https://www.blogger.com/profile/12880827026479135118noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3756272660800605663.post-18758875571985215352018-03-30T03:11:48.404-07:002018-03-30T03:11:48.404-07:00I think. Its etymology is dubious, though (I remem...<i> I think. Its etymology is dubious, though (I remembered a similar root of Bomhard you have posted about this Sum. word for bank, I think it was k'ar or something like).</i><br /><br />I agree! :).Nirjhar007https://www.blogger.com/profile/12880827026479135118noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3756272660800605663.post-73137451082546091862018-03-30T03:01:14.234-07:002018-03-30T03:01:14.234-07:00Hi Nirjhar,
I could not find s'ram in Pokorny,...Hi Nirjhar,<br />I could not find s'ram in Pokorny, which has a root (ker-5?), kō̆r- "to hang": Material: Lit. kariù, kárti `with a Strick erhöngen', lett. kar'u, kãrt `höngen', lit. pakara `Kleiderstönder, peg, plug zum Kleideraufhöngen', lett. pakars `hook zum Aufhöngen', Old Prussian paccaris `strap', lit. pakorė̃ `gallows'; perhaps also lit. prã-kartas `crib, manger', Old Prussian pracartis `trough', if originally `vorgehöngter Futtersack'; in addition perhaps as extension *krem(ǝ)- in gr. κρεμάννυμι `hönge', older κρίμνημι ds. (besides κρήμνημι, s. Specht KZ 59, 97), κρέμαμαι `hange', κρεμάθρᾱ `Höngematte', zero grade κρημνός `slope'.<br /><br />κρημνός kreemnos "slope" (also bank" etc) leads to the other Sum kar "bank" etc, I think. Its etymology is dubious, though (I remembered a similar root of Bomhard you have posted about this Sum. word for bank, I think it was k'ar or something like).<br />https://translate.academic.ru/%CE%BA%CF%81%CE%B7%CE%BC%CE%BD%CF%8C%CF%82/el/xx/<br />Kyriakos Samelishttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09514429998909094452noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3756272660800605663.post-56133263766587079002018-03-30T02:25:12.541-07:002018-03-30T02:25:12.541-07:00Yes :).Yes :).Nirjhar007https://www.blogger.com/profile/12880827026479135118noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3756272660800605663.post-90589820352962480662018-03-30T01:15:57.937-07:002018-03-30T01:15:57.937-07:00This *krem of κρεμάννυμι is seen by some as the ro...This *krem of κρεμάννυμι is seen by some as the root of Skrt. s'ram- "fatigue, toil" etc (it is stated also by Mayrhofer):<br />http://spokensanskrit.org/index.php?tran_input=zrama&direct=se&script=hk&link=yes&mode=3Kyriakos Samelishttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09514429998909094452noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3756272660800605663.post-82156001110942356132018-03-29T06:52:54.620-07:002018-03-29T06:52:54.620-07:00This is fascinating again :).This is fascinating again :).Nirjhar007https://www.blogger.com/profile/12880827026479135118noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3756272660800605663.post-51902458639914758762018-03-29T06:31:19.806-07:002018-03-29T06:31:19.806-07:00BTW, I had another curious idea also about Sum. ka...BTW, I had another curious idea also about Sum. kar [BLOW] (52x: Ur III, Old Babylonian) wr. kar2-kar2; kar2 "to blow; to light up, shine; to rise" Akk. napāhu<br />If we assume that ila "elevation" and la/lal "hang, suspend" are connected; also the notions of light up. rise are connected too, like in Sum. kar; then Gr. κρεμάννυμι kremannymi "to hang up" etc, maybe ultimately from some *ker- (like *trem if from *ter).... https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/%CE%BA%CF%81%CE%B5%CE%BC%CE%AC%CE%BD%CE%BD%CF%85%CE%BC%CE%B9<br />https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/%CF%84%CF%81%CE%AD%CE%BC%CF%89#Ancient_Greek<br />... could be perhaps connected to Latin cremo "to burn" *( < *krem < *ker ?) <br />https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/cremo#Latin<br />Kyriakos Samelishttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09514429998909094452noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3756272660800605663.post-308265990317212022018-03-29T06:03:41.842-07:002018-03-29T06:03:41.842-07:00 I of course agree :). I of course agree :).Nirjhar007https://www.blogger.com/profile/12880827026479135118noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3756272660800605663.post-63312082710315570942018-03-29T05:24:13.641-07:002018-03-29T05:24:13.641-07:00Sum. lal "strap" is most probably connec...Sum. lal "strap" is most probably connected to la/lal "hang" etc; and, if you remember, I had this idea that this lal for strap could be perhaps related to the root of Latin "lorum"; with ambiguous etymology, maybe from *wel "turn" (like in kwel/wel/tel), but nothing is sure: <br />https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/lorum#Latin<br />https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/%D5%AC%D5%A1%D6%80#Old_Armenian<br />In any case we could have a l/r situation here.Kyriakos Samelishttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09514429998909094452noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3756272660800605663.post-37684702756005031042018-03-29T04:43:25.905-07:002018-03-29T04:43:25.905-07:00Very interesting! :).Very interesting! :).Nirjhar007https://www.blogger.com/profile/12880827026479135118noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3756272660800605663.post-55703826827604748082018-03-29T04:21:06.564-07:002018-03-29T04:21:06.564-07:00About these il words, like ila "elavation&quo...About these il words, like ila "elavation" etc there is also a Sum. la [HANG] (1399x: ED IIIa, ED IIIb, Old Akkadian, Lagash II, Ur III, Early Old Babylonian, Old Babylonian) wr. la2; la; lal2 "to supervise, check; to weigh, weigh (out), pay; to hang, balance, suspend, be suspended; to show, display; to bind; binding, (yoke-)team; to press, throttle; to winnow (grain); to carry" Akk. alālu; hanāqu; hiāţu; kamû; kasû; şimittu; kullumu; šaqālu; šuqalulu; zarû<br />According to J. Halloran is lal, lá: v., to be high; to hold; to lift; to carry; to hang (from) (with -ta-); to weigh; to pay; to deduce;<br />to strap, harness (with -ši-); to dress oneself; to place, set; to bind (a reed pillar); to stretch, extend, reach; to load; to lessen, be few, diminish; to accuse, denounce; to fall back, retreat (cf. also, lá) (reduplicated íla, 'to carry, support') [LA2 archaic frequency: 57]. adj., light, deficient; minus (cf. also, lá).<br /><br />Maybe there is a connection also to *telH, like we assumed with ila<br />https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/Reconstruction:Proto-Indo-European/telh%E2%82%82-<br />Though I'm not sure exactly if lal is a reduplication of la which could be from ila, or if we could assume a lal/tal equation (like in case of d/l).<br />Kyriakos Samelishttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09514429998909094452noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3756272660800605663.post-90053396519087015752018-03-29T01:38:57.088-07:002018-03-29T01:38:57.088-07:00Yes, I agree with you :).Yes, I agree with you :).Nirjhar007https://www.blogger.com/profile/12880827026479135118noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3756272660800605663.post-13243306614430332662018-03-28T23:18:29.995-07:002018-03-28T23:18:29.995-07:00Hi Nirjhar,
About Sum. ig [DOOR] (396x: Old Akkadi...Hi Nirjhar,<br />About Sum. ig [DOOR] (396x: Old Akkadian, Lagash II, Ur III, Early Old Babylonian, Old Babylonian) wr. ĝešig; ig "door" Akk. daltu; at the ePSD there is also ig gub [OPEN?] (4x: Old Babylonian) wr. ĝešig gub "to let a door stand open?; to dislodge a door" (ig[door] + gub[stand]).<br />I cannot think of a Gr. word meaning "door" here; but I think there is one meaning "open"; used also, or mostly, for doors; this is οἴγω oigo "open":<br />http://www.perseus.tufts.edu/hopper/text?doc=Perseus%3Atext%3A1999.04.0057%3Aentry%3Doi)%2Fgw<br />Etymology given: prob. ὀ-ϝειγ- [o-weig-] and ὀ-ϝι^γ- [o-wig-], cf. Skt. véga- 'quick movement' ; cf. ἐπῴχατο, προσοίγνυμι.)<br />I've seen also a comparison to Skrt. vijate [vij-]:<br />http://spokensanskrit.org/index.php?tran_input=vijate&direct=se&script=hk&link=yes&mode=3<br />with a meaning of violent moving (like moving the door perhaps).<br />This is random, obviously, I think just this root *w(e)ig could fit morphologically to Sum. "ig".<br /><br />Kyriakos Samelishttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09514429998909094452noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3756272660800605663.post-7525091663573425712018-03-20T07:48:17.621-07:002018-03-20T07:48:17.621-07:00Yes, it is good imo :) .Yes, it is good imo :) .Nirjhar007https://www.blogger.com/profile/12880827026479135118noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3756272660800605663.post-65486033254211519832018-03-20T07:39:00.116-07:002018-03-20T07:39:00.116-07:00BTW, εἵλη heile reminds also Gr. δείλη deile "...BTW, εἵλη heile reminds also Gr. δείλη deile "afternoon", which could be from some *gwel (?) > deil (?)<br />http://www.perseus.tufts.edu/hopper/text?doc=Perseus%3Atext%3A1999.04.0058%3Aentry%3Ddei%2FlhKyriakos Samelishttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09514429998909094452noreply@blogger.com